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Hep C Discussion Forum -> General Discussion -> False Liver Biopsy?
Post Info TOPIC: False Liver Biopsy?
mc99


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RE: False Liver Biopsy?
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I have some of the same concerns about my biopsy report which only had two or three sentences on it the last one said early signs of chirrosis. The biopsy was done one month after diagnosis of hep, I did not get any sedation for the procedure there was no ct guiding done it was totally free hand and only one sample. I was told that it would be sent tto the Mayo clinic which it was not, 2 days later they called me and told me I needed to start tx asap. I didn't even know where my liver was until the bx, so I'm wondering to if the results are accurate. Guess I will just wait until I'm done with tx and see how that turns out and get another bx in a year or two. The whole thing that led me there in the first place was abdominal pain which a ct confirmed was gall stones which the GI doc was not concerned about at all and would not consider removing.

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Kay


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I havent had a biopsy yet. I go Monday. Just wondering how accurate the biopsies are considering the liver is the largest organ. I was just wondering if perhaps it is common for part of the liver to be clean and part cirrhotic?confuse Are they pretty accurate?



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Deidre


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it's common for hcv people to get stones and gallbladder out. I had mine taken out the month before treatment.

 By the way, I have never had sedation with the 3 biopsies I've had.

Hopefully your biopsy will get better after treatment. The whole Mayo bit, sounds like you are not sure about your doctor. Hope you changed Docs before starting treatment.

when they take two, they always go back in through the same hole. Wouldn't want two holes. Just because they go in the same hole does not mean they are taking from the same depth, or even area.

 Kinda like you can get both tubes tied, through one hole at belly button., they don't go to each ovary and make a seperate hole for it, nor would you want them to.

Don't let the people on here scare you. Liver biopsy is the only way to judge liver damage, and since I've had 3, I can tell you it's not a huge deal. It's fast, you may feel some shoulder discomfort, and maybe side discomfort afterwards, but short lived, and not something even requiring pain meds for.

You need to take control over your liver, wich getting a biopsy is the first step in doing. and people that have bad stories, really shouldn't be scaring someone that has never had one. What happens if you scare them, so they put off, and wind up with chirrosis? 

You will find more people on here that have not had a bad experience, than just a couple that do.

-- Edited by Deidre on Wednesday 1st of February 2012 02:32:15 AM



-- Edited by Deidre on Wednesday 1st of February 2012 02:42:30 AM

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 2nd time on tx Started 3 combo ( Incivek) 8/6/11 VL 2,940,000 Biopsy 2/2 w/bridging and some necrosis/Fibrosis/Inflammation.  4th week det, but in und range, 6th ,9th  13th, 19th, 23 ( under 5)-UNDETECTABLE Going for 30 weeks
Iris Dragonfly


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I have had them break a specimen and they said it wouldn't be an accurate "reading", and they went back in the same hole for another sample, OUCH!

I wonder if your sample was mishandled ??? Hope you get some answers soon.

Blessings, Iris



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60 years on planet, Female, diagnosed 1978 as non-a non-b, VL 8mill+, Fibro f-1f-2, Genotype 1a, treatment naïve....UNTIL 7-01-18  !!!! started Harvoni 12 weeks. :)

4 weeks=UND, 8 weeks=UND, 12 weeks=UND (EOT= 09-23-2018)
Deidre


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 I have asked the same question myself before. See in 2002 I had the first one, it came back a 3 ( I remember thinking that doesn't sound bad. Then the nurse explained it only goes to 4..which changed my perception.)

That first biobsy was  a month before I did treatment in 02. In 07 I had another, and it came back a 2. I also had another july 2011 right before starting treatment this time, also a 2. 

 

Chirosis can't be fixed, so even if they managed to take a sample from one corner that had chirosis, it would still mean you had chirosis, even if only in that corner. That means part of your liver is dead. It also means you have to be on treatment longer. 

Usually they take 2 samples, when they do it. My last one was while I was getting my gallbladder out, so they actually took a corner ( bigger than a normal biopsy). the month before I started treatment, this time.

 You may be wondering why I went from a 3 to a 2. That's because while I was in remission on treatment in 02, it allowed my liver to start to heal, from the fibrosis, and necrosis. I also had/have portal bridging.

There is no better test. The other year they came out with a Fibrosure blood test, which is expensive, and not acurate, it tends to only pick up one extreme to the other, and isn't good at reading anything in between. I know this from first-hand experience. 3 biopsies, one fibrosure. all 3 showed the fibrosis, but the blood test didn't.

The other thing is just runing normal liver panel tests like viral load, or AST ALT, doesn't always clearly tell if the liver is being damaged. My ALT AST have never been off, except after I started treatment this time. 

Many people and even some doctors that are gp's don't know this. They tend to think if the liver panel blood tests are okay than the liver must be also. So you can imagine how surprised they were back in 02 to find out I was a 3.

Viral load, also is not a good indicator of damage. Viral loads can fluctuate, by millions.

 A ultra sound can sometimes pick up cancer, or chirosis, but other than that, it's usually just inflamation that it shows. With chirosis, sometimes it will apear smaller.

So right now the best test there is, is biopsy, it's considered the gold standard. They use biopsies on the body to tesll if something has cancer.

If they thought you had a tumor in your kidney, they would biopsy it to see if it was bening or not.

Chances are it would pick it up. Also keep in mind that when they biopsy a liver, they are using a scan to direct them. They can usually see, areas of concern, and that's where they take the samples from, it's not just a stab in the dark, guessing.



-- Edited by Deidre on Tuesday 31st of January 2012 10:47:42 PM

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 2nd time on tx Started 3 combo ( Incivek) 8/6/11 VL 2,940,000 Biopsy 2/2 w/bridging and some necrosis/Fibrosis/Inflammation.  4th week det, but in und range, 6th ,9th  13th, 19th, 23 ( under 5)-UNDETECTABLE Going for 30 weeks
Deidre


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liver biopsy is the most acurate. I've had 3



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 2nd time on tx Started 3 combo ( Incivek) 8/6/11 VL 2,940,000 Biopsy 2/2 w/bridging and some necrosis/Fibrosis/Inflammation.  4th week det, but in und range, 6th ,9th  13th, 19th, 23 ( under 5)-UNDETECTABLE Going for 30 weeks
Kay


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Is it possible/common to get a good or bad report from the liver biopsy but it be a false report because they perhaps got a sample from a portion that does represent the whole liver? How often does that happen?hmm



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