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Hep C Discussion Forum -> On Treatment -> hit a vein :(
Post Info TOPIC: hit a vein :(
Isiscat2011


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RE: hit a vein :(
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You are very intellectually curious, Brad.  Like looking into a mirror. 

All I can think now is "Those poor monkeys and rats."  Poor babies.

On the upside, I guess it might not hurt us too bad if it happened. biggrin



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Diagnosed in 2011, Incivek triple in 2011, tx discontinued, Genotype 1a, CT, VL 7mill, cirrhosis dx in 2012, age 67, waiting for new DAAs.
krowdog


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I got interested in what would actually happen if one were to IV Peg-interferon.  Call it morbid curiosity.  I've heard everything from "you would instantly die" to "It wouldn't make any difference". 

Well, we all know if something CAN happen, it eventually WILL happen.

In my searches, I found a very scholarly report at:

http://www.ema.europa.eu/docs/en_GB/document_library/EPAR_-_Scientific_Discussion/human/000395/WC500039192.pdf

A couple of quotes from Page 5/58:

"In rats, following iv single bolus administration (0.2-0.4 ml) of peginterferon, a half-life of approximately 15 hours was found..."

and

"The pharmacokinetic profile of interferon activity in plasma after the subcutaneous administration of peginterferon to rats and monkeys was characterised by sustained absorption and prolonged terminal phase half-life, indicating slower elimination. The terminal phase half-life of interferon activity after administration of peginterferon was approximately 150-200 hours in monkeys, compared to 9 hours after administration of unmodified interferon."

If you read the report it appears the IV injection was not toxic, but dramatically reduces the peg-interferon half life.

Another interesting point is the Sub Q half life time (for rats and monkeys) is listed at 150-200 hours. That's about 6 -8 days, which corresponds exactly to our weekly shot schedule.

Anyway, I just found this all interesting.

Brad

(Geno 1a, Incivek Triple Tx, In week 23 of 24)





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(Geno 1a, Incivek Triple Tx, 6 month post TX - 9/20/2012 = SVR!!!)
Isiscat2011


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Alan:  You can't reach your butt with both hands on your cheeks?  Hmmm....either your arms are too short, or your butt is too small, or maybe you just need a third hand.  lol  Nope, I couldn't manage it on my own either. 

I'll bet Cathy would gladly do that.  The first time I had another person do it I kept moving away....getting farther and farther away from that needle....with my shooter commanding "Stop moving or I can't do this!" the whole time.  After we both cracked up laughing, we finally had to count to 3 while I braced myself by holding onto a chair.  You get used to it and it isn't hard after that.  The butt shots really did beat the heck out of using my legs, and the belly shots seem to get irritated for some people.

I'm pretty sure that if the drug went inside a vein it would be very bad b/c interferon is not supposed to be injected intravenously.  But, it would have to go through a layer of fat and a layer of muscle first, and that seems highly unlikely given the size of the needle.



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Diagnosed in 2011, Incivek triple in 2011, tx discontinued, Genotype 1a, CT, VL 7mill, cirrhosis dx in 2012, age 67, waiting for new DAAs.
alohaKim


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I don't think it's hitting a vein. I think it may have hit and burst a small blood vessel.

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Genotype 1a, non responder to Peg/Riba in 2005. Started triple therapy 1-27-12 with Victrelis.  UNDETECTABLE as of 8wk labs (after 4 weeks of Victrelis) 4-3-12. UND at week 8, 12, 16 & 20 of tx. Completed triple therapy Oct 2012. relapsed 10/2012
news


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I'm just a silly man, so take what I say with however many grains of salt you need. I can't reach my butt with both hands on the same cheek at the same time and pinch an inch and do a proper shot and put on a bandaid all by myself. Cathy and I have been married almost 40 years, but I still have not found the words to ask her to give me my shot. I always go to the bedroom and usually use the belly or thigh. On the thigh I can see small veins under the skin. On the belly it's just chubbiness, no veins. But I have never been unlucky enough to hit a vein. If I did, I would only wonder about the effectiveness of the shot. Does it still work? Alan

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Geno 1A  Started Pegasys/Ribavirin/Incivek Nov. 20, 2011 .  Completed July 28, 2012 (36 weeks). For a treatment history, see:  https://jshare.johnshopkins.edu/xythoswfs/webview/_xy-9921874_1

SVR on January 14, 2013!!
Isiscat2011


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Probably not a vein or you would still be bleeding!  The butt is the best place for subcutaneous injections; this is why nurses don't give patients sub-q shots in the belly or leg.  Of course they don't get the artistic pleasure. biggrin



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Diagnosed in 2011, Incivek triple in 2011, tx discontinued, Genotype 1a, CT, VL 7mill, cirrhosis dx in 2012, age 67, waiting for new DAAs.
Phil G


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And its happened to me once out of 18 shots. If you knew when its going to happen, you could arrange it in the middle of the belly art.



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Geno 1A, VL 1.9 mm, SOT 12/2/11 - Pegintron/Ribavirin/Victrelis, UND since wk 8, EOT 6/15/12 (28 wks), SVR 11/30/12
alohaKim


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This happened to me last night.  I have an ugly purple bruise and it bled a bit more than just the normal one or two drops.  It didn't hurt, but the bruise came up immediately, like before I even got the needle out.  I'm alright though.  Just added some color to my belly flower. 



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Genotype 1a, non responder to Peg/Riba in 2005. Started triple therapy 1-27-12 with Victrelis.  UNDETECTABLE as of 8wk labs (after 4 weeks of Victrelis) 4-3-12. UND at week 8, 12, 16 & 20 of tx. Completed triple therapy Oct 2012. relapsed 10/2012
Hep Me


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It happened to me once too. Did shot in front belly area and bled like crazy.

Randy

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kiwi


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nope ive always used my gut, never had a problem till the other night. its ok, its a nice lookin bruise now tho... dunno why it didnt go as smooth as the other ones...

always been too scared to use legs or arms... ive done drugs in the distant past and even using a needle these days sucks... :( 

get clean, get my life together, and bam, karma comes up and kicks me ass. yup...



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kiwi. genotype 1. started pegasus and riba on 10 nov. VL 17.6 million. (4 weeks VL 1368)  week 15 UNDETECTED... :)
Lindsay


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Did you take your shot on your leg? I know this in no way compares to your meds, but I used to have to give myself allergy immunotherapy injections, and like the interferon, it was subcutaneous. I found that nearly every time I used my legs, I would hit a vessel and it is so painful and bruises so much. I just decided that aside from when I would go every 10 weeks to get a new bottle, I would just use my stomach. Never had a problem there thankfully. I hope you heal quickly and avoid those blood vessels!!!

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kiwi


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shaun.. yup lol algudz ay...

got me smiling anywayz.... hee hee



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kiwi. genotype 1. started pegasus and riba on 10 nov. VL 17.6 million. (4 weeks VL 1368)  week 15 UNDETECTED... :)
peanutbutter


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I got blood in my drawback once and called the Pegasus hotline thing and she said as long as its not like I pulp fiction when Vince vegas shooting up with a lot a lot I was fine. God bless- mike

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Diagnosed in 2008. Geno 1a. 6 month treatment of Incivek. UND at 4 weeks, and have remained that way as of 2 months POST treatment.
Anna Christie


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Sorry that happened Kiwi. Always some crap to deal with on this stuff. Glad you got #12 down. 



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Shaun


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kiwi wrote:

thanks guys. yup got a helluva decent purple bruise that looks like its gonna be a goodn.. but the yellow bit is just a dodgy bruise colour so im not so freaked out... and for sure i will be careful next time...

just gave me a freak out. more war wounds to show off. lol

 Everytime I see your avatar I cant help laughing.  Just sayin....



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kiwi


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thanks guys. yup got a helluva decent purple bruise that looks like its gonna be a goodn.. but the yellow bit is just a dodgy bruise colour so im not so freaked out... and for sure i will be careful next time...

just gave me a freak out. more war wounds to show off. lol



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kiwi. genotype 1. started pegasus and riba on 10 nov. VL 17.6 million. (4 weeks VL 1368)  week 15 UNDETECTED... :)
Shaun


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I did the same thing on my third shot.  The needle didn't want to go in as smoothly as usual.  It 'popped' through something and hurt like hell.  Bled afterward.

Had a purple bruise for a few weeks.   Have been careful since then to pinch a roll of skin like they do when you get a tetnis shot, and inject into the roll.  No problems since.



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Deidre


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Not sure on that yellow..that doesn't sound right, You have to watch for injection site infections. Would probably be a good idea to show to your doc..today. Always better safe than sorry.



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 2nd time on tx Started 3 combo ( Incivek) 8/6/11 VL 2,940,000 Biopsy 2/2 w/bridging and some necrosis/Fibrosis/Inflammation.  4th week det, but in und range, 6th ,9th  13th, 19th, 23 ( under 5)-UNDETECTABLE Going for 30 weeks
kiwi


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thanks. yeh blood vessel for sure..bout and hour later and its now a narly purple bruise, with a yellow pea shaped thing in the middle...  just freaked myself out a bit is all disbelief 



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kiwi. genotype 1. started pegasus and riba on 10 nov. VL 17.6 million. (4 weeks VL 1368)  week 15 UNDETECTED... :)
Deidre


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I've had that happen ( what you described) but it can also be a bllod vesel. I was told if we did it in a vien, it would kill us. So probably not a vein. Some shots just seem worse, a muscle shot will also be more painful. I did have a lot more bleeding that time too, but it also turned out my plattlets had which had gone back up after I finished the Incivek, had gone back down again rapidly.

When I was on Incivek at it's lowest point it went down to 116, but it did it gradually, and went back up after the Incivek which most blood counts do. However The shot that bled alot, turned out I went from 153 to 114 in just 4 weeks. That is why I suddenly bled more..less clotting.



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 2nd time on tx Started 3 combo ( Incivek) 8/6/11 VL 2,940,000 Biopsy 2/2 w/bridging and some necrosis/Fibrosis/Inflammation.  4th week det, but in und range, 6th ,9th  13th, 19th, 23 ( under 5)-UNDETECTABLE Going for 30 weeks
kiwi


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just did shot 12. usually a slight sting but nothin to worry about..

this time tho, it hurt a bit and it bled when i pulled the needle out, and looks like gonna be a helluva bruise...

just sayin.... buggar...



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kiwi. genotype 1. started pegasus and riba on 10 nov. VL 17.6 million. (4 weeks VL 1368)  week 15 UNDETECTED... :)
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