Hep C Discussion Forum

5-1-18 · Guru

RE: Fasting As A Treatment

Canuck · Guru

hey thanks daka,

Very good info to know. Good of you to share.

So, ah ha, I wondered about you having a prior treatment, or not, I was not sure at first for some reason, I can't recall the mention of interferon/riba until later in this convo - but yet you did use some language which was making me think you were treatment-experienced. Glad I got that straight in my head now. Poor you to do and fail the old treatment.

Really good to know you have had multiple PCR's and other anual testing done over the years. Of course we would be all ears (eyes) to read any of your old VL's, LFT's, did you have biopsies in the past too? Have you been having ultrasounds, or imaging done over the years and/or fibroscans in more recent years?. Would be interesting to know what levels of inflammation activity/fibrosis/cirrhosis you have experienced from the past to now. Any Fscores? You mentioned you just had a work-up that included an U/S? How is your liver and everything looking? How is it's function now, compared to the old days, according to the doc?

Without re-reading the thread I do not rightly recall mention of your GT ... maybe you already said? And, which regime WAS your doc recently planning to give you, before your treatment plan was cancelled?

Thanks for sharing, and please do keep us posted with your updates, labs, and doc visit next. C.

I see below (during your 2011 int/riba treatment) the VL lowered but that they stopped the treatment early due to a technical "fail" after only a few weeks? How long had the doc intended for you to be on int/riba? Yes, much unpleasantness for you.

Well, better yet, if you require NO treatment, ever again!- even if it had been with the excellent, much more tolerable new drugs. Count your lucky stars your most recent VL is UND!

daka · Newbie

Yes Tig I had followup PCR tests annually since the Tx in 2011 or 2011 and they were medium high, regularly, and this testing supported their decision to recommend another new Tx this year. So I think the possible explanation of a delayed response to the failed Interferon Tx in 2011 is highly unlikely which is what got me thinking about other possible explanations. The more I think about it the more suspicious I am that my 14 day fast may be the explanation. There has been a lot of support for fasting as a method to deal with cancer and to enhance cancer treatment plans.

Tig · Admin

Thank you Sean for your explanation and history. I'm thrilled to know you've beaten this thing we call the Dragon and appreciate you taking the time to describe your journey. I for one, am anxious to know what your follow up tests are, especially your metabolic profile. Did you have any follow up PCR's after you failed the I/R treatment, say 6 months or a year following? If not, I wonder if there was some magical clearance secondary to that that you weren't aware of? Doesn't matter, you did it and that is ultimately what matters!

daka · Newbie

Responding to a few responses (especially Canuck's extensive response)

I am not trying to suggest that people do fasting as a treatment regimen at all; I am only passing on my unexpected news of a spontaneous remission and my hypothesis that this remission may be connected to a recent 14 day fast. The fast is the only significant thing I have done in the last year that could possibly explain 'cause/effect'. I am also very keen to know if other people have actually done a long food fast when they had Hep C and whether anyone else might have had a similar experience, or if others have done a long fast and not cleared the virus.

Actually my liver specialist was planning a new treatment regimen which costs £15000 Sterling here in the UK and he was doing these tests to prepare for that treatment, so that he could benchmark and track viral loads. When I went in to begin the treatment I was told that the virus had cleared spontaneously. I didn't even mention the fast because it took me a few days to make this possible connection. He had done Viral Load testing for a few years and has records of active viral load numbers and this is what convinced him to suggest the new treatment. I can't give you the viral loads or dates yet but I will get that information for this thread as soon as I can and post it here because I too am interested in knowing the figures..

It was 1971 ... when it all started and within a few years 'Hep B non-specific' was diagnosed then in maybe 1993 my doctor diagnosed Hep C, so I have had diagnosed Hep C for 25 years and possibly (probably undiagnosed) for 47 years. I had a very unpleasant treatment in 2011 of Interferon/Ribavarin for only a few weeks and extensive tests were done including viral loads which I don't remember but was told though not at the top of the range they were mid range high levels. After the unsuccessful treatment the viral loads rebounded after dropping significantly (but not disappearing).

I too did some googling and discovered the Indian statistics/research suggesting fasting inhibits replication of the virus and this encourages me to consider that the 14 day fast may have had a dramatic effect on MY Hep C virus. I had never done a fast for that long. I doubt many people do 14 day fasts and it would be a very hard research sampling to actually obtain as people are quite fond of their eating rituals etc. I still have a hard time convincing myself to begin a fast though I was delighted with the way I felt through the whole fast; it is hard to rebel against our habits and delights. I have also heard anecdotal support for fasting being able to clear many other diseases so I don't think it can be ruled out as a possible treatment. Again I wonder how many people generally ever do a 14 to 28 day fast? I only know one person and this person inspired me to consider doing my long fast. I suspect it is a very rare human behavior. Actually the treatments for Hep C I believe have all stemmed from research into chemical products that inhibit virus replication so fasting, if as is suggested it inhibits replication, could also be suspected as a possible passive treatment protocol, no? I'm looking forward to discussing my situation with my Liver Specialist as the last meeting was only with the Senior nurse who simply passed on the doctor's decision to abandon the treatment plan due to the remission. They intend to repeat the Viral Load testing in five weeks to make sure those results are stable.

5-1-18 · Guru

i used to go on that optifast diet years ago[ same one oprah was on for weight loss] for a few weeks and i still held the virus..

this is def a good convo and i hope that the virus is gone for good thru the fast or the spontanious healing

Tig · Admin

That’s why we’re discussing it, Will. I would hope people reading the title will be interested enough to continue reading the conversation and not come to a treatment decision by concluding one post is worthy of consideration. We know that fasting isn’t a recognized treatment protocol and I certainly don’t recommend it, but Sean is simply here to discuss it. Thanks for your input.

robertsamx · Guru

WILLBB, Thank you, I could not have said it any better! RC

willbb · Member

Hello daka

The heading of your thread is Fasting as a Treatment. There are hundreds ,if not thousands of people that peruse these forums looking for answers about HCV and the different treatments of such.

They might read your thread and Erroneously surmise that if just simply to try fasting they may be able to cure their HCV.

There has never been a clinical study done nor any peer reviewed articles tabled with this modality as a cure for HCV in mind and folks should be aware of that.

There was some research done recently in Pakistan or India I believe, that Did show that fasting may have some inhibition effect on HCV viron replication. In simplified terms ,it showed that by a reduction of circulating fats in the body there was a reduction in the protein Kinesin which showed somewhat of a reduction of the replication process of virons,however not an eradication of HCV in the body.

Keep in mind that even if there is a reduction of virons it would be of little use clinically as there has been many studies done that comes to the conclusion that viral load amount has no real assimilation to the amount of damage that is being done or possibly not being done to the liver.

I would agree with what has been mentioned to you here ,that possibly you were tested for HCV antibodies at one time and that you spontaneously cleared the virus between then and now.

This happens quite frequently in the acute stage(approx. 15-25% of cases) or possibly as happens very very rarely (approx. .3% ) not 3 % but .3% spontaneous clearance once the virus has settled in and become chronic. (there are studies showing this research)

Fasting as a cure for HCV...Unfortunately no.

Tig · Admin

Hi Sean,

I’m also curious about the last time you had a full set of labs completed. Things like your last PCR and liver profile would be interesting to know. How long had it been since you had a detectable viral load? Has your ALT and AST been elevated at all? If it has been years since they were ran, it’s difficult to pinpoint when a spontaneous clearance occurred. Your story is an interesting one!

5-1-18 · Guru

oh yea,did you get tested for hep B also at anytime?

Canuck · Guru

Hey daka!

I have so many questions for you! smile

So, we can guess (by your guess) that you have had HCV about 47 years, so that would have been about 1971. As they did not have good testing back then to confirm HCV (that was not happening until into the the '80's), we can all just assume that your serum exposure episodes at that time might have been a likely time you might have contracted HCV - not likely any doc back in 1971 would have said to you, "you have hep c" (versus another hepatitis) they might have been able to differentiate between A and B, but C was still in the works over quite a long period of time for coming up with a tried and true test method. For decades folk were undiagnosed, misdiagnosed, labeled like a question mark as being a Non-A/Non-B mystery. Then again, without formal diagnosis to pinpoint dates you were free of hepc and then the date you became positive for hepc, many people can never know exactly when they actually contracted the disease, or even how, despite known or suspected risk factors.

So, what year did you "formally" get diagnosed (blood tested as "positive for the hepc" by showing the antibody, by being genotyped, and what was your viral load then)?

Over this very long period (47 years), OR from your "official/formal" diagnosis, to now - surely they have periodically taken some blood and other tests on you to follow your chronic hep c? What have some of your liver function tests and viral loads been over the years? We would be most interested to know your loads, GT and labs, symptoms and how you have faired over such a long period of time.

It would be good info to know how much time has elapsed between this most current "negative" viral load (which, it would be nice to know what the actual language/number measurements say on your report), and, the previous viral load(s) done on you ? Perhaps if some time has elapsed between these two load measurements, there may be some other variables at play here, other than a diet cure.

A small number of people do and can spontaneously resolve their hep c's (like as can happen in people who are exposed to the hep b virus, and contract the b virus into their body), there is this ability for a small number of people to come out of an acute bout of hep c (or an acute bout of a hep b infection) and resolve the acute infection on their own, and they do not necessarily go on to become a chronically infected hep c or hep b person (become a carrier).

So, you would need to (rule out) verify for yourself that (1) you were ever correctly initially diagnosed as truly having "chronic" hep c, by way of formal testing, and VL result history, and (2) you would better prove the diet cure theory by showing a viral load of (say ... just an example ... if you had a VL of 100,000 exactly the day before your started your diet, and then, after your 14 day diet, (like day 15 or whatever) you showed no viral load, and continued to show no viral load 12 weeks later, then 24 weeks later, and then possibily in another 6 months? It would be much harder for folk to not think it more likely it was only the diet that had an effect on your load.

Please, please post your new/old labs, VL's, LFT's - I am very intrigued by your post.

And BTW, if that diet works, maaan, I would be sooooo well cured, just ask Tig and Obs how much I LOOOOOVE maple syrup, i'd be drinking a gal a day! biggrin C.

-- Edited by Canuck on Monday 18th of June 2018 08:01:29 PM

5-1-18 · Guru

good luck daka, i too am hoping the 6 week and 6 month viral load shows you are cured.

daka · Newbie

Yes, I intend to have the results confirmed in 6 weeks time and have the appointment set.

Though a strange story many people do swear to fasting having cured various serious illnesses. The googling I did confirmed that research has been done confirming that HCV replication is severely affected by fasting so this can generally be scientifically confirmed. Also 2 week fasts are rare, most people think 2 or 3 days is a mammoth achievement. The 14 days was new for me too but I found that the longer the fast became the happier I was and the clearer my mind was so I do recommend it generally AND I would be interested in knowing from anyone else who might attempt a long fast to subdue the virus :)

-- Edited by daka on Sunday 17th of June 2018 02:01:08 PM

Tig · Admin

Hey Sean,

Your story is about as unusual as I’ve ever heard. Congratulations, by the way. If I were you, I’d ask for another PCR test in 6 months, just to confirm SVR. I wouldn’t consider a maple syrup and red pepper fast in the same treatment category as Sovaldi or Mavyret, but regardless of my opinion, you’re a very fortunate to have cleared the virus. Can I call call you our first Fire Breathing, Maple Syrup Slayer? I am quite happy you were able to destroy the beast. Best of luck to you.

daka · Newbie

I contracted Hepatitis 'C' 47 years ago as an adventuresome hippie experimenting with 'Speed'. Recently I was being prepared for the new treatment regimen by my liver specialist, undergoing blood tests for viral load and an ultrasound. Much to my shock they told me my viral load was 'not measurable' an indication that treatment (if started) would be stopped and deemed 'successful', therefore there was no need for treatment.

Seemed like a miracle, suddenly to be spontaneously free from the virus after 47 years! I then realized that two months ago I did a 14 day food fast and this is the only explanation I can come up with for my remission. A google search did indicate that fasting does have an effect on the replication of the virus; the virus apparently does not thrive on fasting :)

If anyone is interested in the details of my fasting regimen I am happy to pass them on. I followed what is called the Maple Sugar fast: a fasting regimen based on hot water, a small amount of maple syrup and cayenne pepper; one can drink as much as they like all day.

Sean

-- Edited by daka on Sunday 17th of June 2018 11:46:13 AM

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